KawasakiTrax Community
General Category => Kawasaki Owners => Topic started by: gixxer6 on November 21, 2017, 08:43:27 AM
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It must have been around 10 years since I started this project, now that the youngest is off to college I can finally get back to it. The Intimidator starts as a 79 Invader chassis that has been powder coated:
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larger 4/6 heat exchanger installed:
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Fiberglass pan sanded (NO filler) and painted:
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Pan installed:
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Skis, Bumpers and bits, lots of powder coat and stainless everywhere...
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Waaay cool!
Both you and mswyka are working on a Kawi green sled....gotta love that color.
What do you have up your sleeve on this one?
You have a newer Vari-Ride rear skid to put under it?
You goin' with a 1" lug track?
What engine do you have on the workbench?....an LTD 440 with Interceptor jugs, head, pistons....? Even a standard Invader engine would be fine....but you probably have something more planned... 8) ::) :P
Please keep the pics coming!
Rick
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I just installed 120 one inch studs in a 90’s Ski-Doo 3/4” lug track. It should do quite well on the ice. :D
I haven’t completely decided on the rear skid quite yet... Initially I planned to install the stock 79 Invader rear skid with a gas shock, but I do have a couple Vari-Ride skids from 4/6’s. Being a drag race inspired sled I’m leaning more towards the lower 79 skid.
More to come regarding the motor...
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Looks like a very nice project. I really like the powder coating.
While my preference is for the 4/6 skid, my sense is that you are right in picking the 79 skid for your purpose.
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The 4/6 skid definitely rides nicer. :/
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That colour will look amazing on the snow. Can’t wait to see the finished product.
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Got the holes cut in the lightweight fiberglass hood, windshield trimmed down, and everything mocked up before sending the hood for paint.
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Pretty cool can't wait to see more progress.
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Skid parts back from powder coating. Just waiting on the cross shafts then it’s time to assemble.
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So you did finally settle on the 79 skid.
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What will this sled weigh when finished
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What will this sled weigh when finished
Great question! I don't really have a target weight. All I know for sure is that it will be lighter than a stock Invader.
Tips for weight reduction?
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Just enough gas for one run !!! ;)
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Carbon fiber http://patrickcustomcarbon.com/
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So you did finally settle on the 79 skid.
I decided to go with the lower 79 skid. I FINALLY got it together, well mostly...I’m still missing some bolts and limiter straps. This skid was a nightmare. I had a horrible time getting the old slides out. Once I got the rails cleaned up I had a hard time getting the new slide installed. I ended up destroying one and getting it stuck on the rail. I finally gave up , ordered a new slde and pulled a different rail from another skid. At least it turned out nice!
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After having done the suspension for the cancer charity sled that to do one properly is a LOT of effort. Nice job! ;D
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any suspension is a pain to get nice, very nice job there...
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Intimidator seat:
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Looking good
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So... I learned something new this week...Did you know that it is impossible to exactly match liquid paint to powder coat? I didn’t! I talked directly with the powder coating manufacturer, they said that the color can be matched exactly in one light, then look completely different in another (paint it to match exactly in your shop, Drive it outside and you have two different colors).
The Intimidator hood all painted, gloss black:
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This sled is lookin' really good.. :D
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Tank, seat, taillight, steering stem, jackshaft all mounted.
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Impressive! That powder coating is beautiful.
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I wrestled the skid in today:
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Nice job!!!
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A sneak peek of things to come:
Blue is poster board, silver is aluminum sheet.
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Man this thing looks mean! Nice job
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A sneak peek of things to come:
Blue is poster board, silver is aluminum sheet.
I like the aluminum. Are you fabricating these in any quantity?
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A sneak peek of things to come:
Blue is poster board, silver is aluminum sheet.
I like the aluminum. Are you fabricating these in any quantity?
Just making the one at this point. But I do still have the template.
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Lots of tweaking to do but the initial bends are done.
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Trying to decide what color to do the dash in. I've been thinking about brushing the aluminum, powder coating it the same green as the tunnel, or powder coating it satin black (looks similar to the finish of the stock plastic).
What do you think?
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I think the satin black would look good.
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Mirror finish Like chrome would really stand out
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Mirror finish Like chrome would really stand out
Interesting idea, but I'm leaning towards the satin black. I have something else planned for the dash that will make it stand out... ;)
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I decided to go a different route with the skis, the stockers just seemed too heavy. :D I got them all installed last night. Once I get the dash fitting complete, and the headlight installed, I can set it down off the stands then get the motor installed.
There's a local vintage drag race near me on 2/10. It's going to be close, but I think I'm going to make it!
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What kind of skis are they?
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What kind of skis are they?
Wahl aluminum drag skis. 4lbs each.
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Is it Intimidating?
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Looks awesome. I like the look with the lowered windshield. What kind of head light are u using ?
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It is a 4x6 projector style. It uses a standard halogen bulb and has green LEDs. It was super cheap, but took some minor modification and some custom brackets. It was definitely not an easy swap.
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Keep an eye on those rivets on the ski spring brackets on the skis the last set we drilled them out and put bolts in with lock nuts.
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Is it Intimidating?
Is that a neon green headlamp? Is there actually such a thing?
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Is it Intimidating?
Is that a neon green headlamp? Is there actually such a thing?
Green LED's. 8)
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Keep an eye on those rivets on the ski spring brackets on the skis the last set we drilled them out and put bolts in with lock nuts.
Thanks for the heads-up, I will keep an eye on them. What happens? Do they loosen? Break?
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They loosen up the rivets then if not caught the problems begin
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Is that a neon green headlamp? Is there actually such a thing?
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Green LED's. 8)
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I think that I may need to get one of those.
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Dash is FINALLY ready for powder coat. I must’ve had it on and off at least 100 times while fitting it. I’m very happy with it.
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Gauges fit good. :)
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Wow, that is a pretty big tach! And where did you score an odometer reading zero?
Nice job on the aluminum too.
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Thanks! It’s a 5” tach, I think the aluminum dash coated in satin black will look really nice with that big white tach installed.
I have a handful of NOS gauges that I have accumulated over the years. This specific one came from the A1 swap meet last fall.
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Back from powder coating.
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Looking good !!!
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You must have an exceptional powder coating connection to get these parts back so fast.
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We have a local shop that is 30 minutes from me. They do excellent work, and most of the time I have my parts back within a week. Occasionally they get backed up and it takes a couple weeks. The best part is they are priced super reasonable. I paid $15 to have the dash done.
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So your going to be offering aftermarket dash options? :)
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Funny thing is...I am a manufacturing engineer during the day, so I’m always thinking about how I would go about producing these kind of projects in quantities. It would be fairly simple to do, I have the template I’d need to get it to someone with a plasma cutting table then I could bend them by hand (bending it was the easiest part).
What would be a fair price for an unpainted dash?
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Really like how your sled is turning out Gixxer. You've done an awesome job on it ! My boss is a terrific mechanical engineer who's amazing with SolidWorks. He can create and get made things from metal I wouldn't dream of. If you took that dash panel to any competent fab shop they could reproduce them in quantity for you. We do it all the time. Takes quantities of at least 5 to realize and cost reduction, one of anything custom is always pricey.
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Really like how your sled is turning out Gixxer. You've done an awesome job on it ! My boss is a terrific mechanical engineer who's amazing with SolidWorks. He can create and get made things from metal I wouldn't dream of. If you took that dash panel to any competent fab shop they could reproduce them in quantity for you. We do it all the time. Takes quantities of at least 5 to realize and cost reduction, one of anything custom is always pricey.
Thanks! I’m happy with how it’s turning out.
Producing these types of products is something that I am very familiar with. I know that I could take these to a fab shop and have them made easily, the problem is the cost. To just give it to a fab shop and have them made in the low quantities that there is a market for would be cost prohibitive. But if I found a place that has a plasma table and would cut me 20 of them and I did the bending myself, I think they could be priced low enough that they would actually sell. I definitely wouldn’t make much profit.
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Some of the decals are on. Finally got it off the stand! Dash and gauges installed.
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Motor going in tomorrow. It’s a 440 Invader motor that has been ported and heads shaved. I’m starting fairly mild until I get some experience, then I will make it a little more wild. :)
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Looks great I know of a shop that has a laser cutter way cleaner cutting ability than a plasma cutter. Call Aaen have mod pipes custom built the new style he makes
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Thanks! I already called Aaen, they want WAY too much for the new pipes, plus they said they need the sled there to fit them.
Want to see if the shop will quote some of the dash panels?
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What gears do you plan to run? And how do you plan to set up the primary and secondary?
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The race is less than two weeks away, so I will have very little time to dial it in. I’m going to run a stock 4/6 secondary, and a modified primary. I set the primary up years ago to run on my stock Invader, it has E ramps modified to Aaen spec and a red spring. It makes for a hard, high rpm launch and pulls hard all the way through. I’m starting with stock 440 Invader gears. The race is 500 feet.
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The race is less than two weeks away, so I will have very little time to dial it in. I’m going to run a stock 4/6 secondary, and a modified primary. I set the primary up years ago to run on my stock Invader, it has E ramps modified to Aaen spec and a red spring. It makes for a hard, high rpm launch and pulls hard all the way through. I’m starting with stock 440 Invader gears. The race is 500 feet.
Where is the race? Will you be side by side or racing the clock?
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Other than knowing it’s 500 feet, this is all the info I have.
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I love following this post. I'm with the others....please tell me you are going to make these dashes available for purchase!!!???
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I love following this post. I'm with the others....please tell me you are going to make these dashes available for purchase!!!???
I will look at it after the race. I can’t believe it’s next weekend already! I’m going to be cutting it close.
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Wiring done. Engine in. Clutches aligned. Oil tank installed. Decals on. Just need to finish cleaning the carbs, install the radiator, pipes and run the fuel lines. Then motor break in and tuning. I might need to take a day off work to get it all done.
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I’m starting out with a set of the Kawasaki kit pipes. They needed a little repair:
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Welding
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Before and after blasting
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All painted
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Here it is with the pipes installed. Can you guess which one was repaired? I guess you could say it’s “done”, although complete, or assembled is probably a better discription.
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That looks REALLY nice!!
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Best of luck with the racing this weekend.
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Not going to make the race. :( the motor needs to come back out.
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what kind of damage did the pipe have?
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It was rusted through where the radiator shroud drips on it when it rains. You can see the putting and holes in the first pics on page 5. There was also an impressive mouse nest inside along with a dead mouse :o
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Not going to make the race. :( the motor needs to come back out.
Oh no, what happened? Sled looks great BTW. Definitely a direction I'd like to go, eventually.
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The stator has a bad pulser coil. I tried to remove flywheel with motor still installed ended up cracking the case.
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Sorry to hear that. I can only imagine your disappointment when that happened. :(
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Oh no!!! I'm a little grumpy too but that is a story for another thread.
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It runs! Motor out, new stator installed and replaced the cracked flywheel housing, motor back in, timing set. Whew, that was easy (sarcasm...) :o
Now I just need to figure out what I did wrong with the mag side carb. It's only running on one cylinder. :(
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Nice job! Good luck!!
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I went through the mag side carb with an extremely fine toothed comb...I thought I found the issue immediately looking at he float adjustment. One side was bent up higher than the other. Everything else looked great. But it STILL will not fire on the mag side. I have compression, fuel, spark, and timing. The only thing left is AIR. The mag side pipe happens to be the one that I repaired and had a mouse nest. I spent quite a bit of time cleaning the nest out before welding and blasting. I would bet my left spark plug that I got it all out. My theory is when they sand blasted the pipes, they used a rag to plug the holes and keep sand out of the pipe. I'd be willing to bet that one of those rags are still in there...
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can you feel air at the ex pipe exit?
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Nope, no air coming through at all.
It took a shop vac on one side and 120psi compressed air on the other to dislodge this mouse mess.
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That is remarkable. But would explain quite a bit.
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Dang varmints!! The high pressure hose at the car wash works pretty good for getting that kind of stuff out. Been there!!!
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I thought about using the pressure washer but feared that it would get stuck in one of the baffles further in. Then I'd really be screwed!
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Temps dropped last night (it has been upper 40's the last 2 days) and it's snowing now. If all goes well the Intimidator will take it's maiden voyage tonight. 8)
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Lol just went through the same problem last week! One of my invaders I rescued was sitting in a barn since 88 , I totally went through the whole sled except the muffler. Starts first pull but lacked power since I rebuilt the engine I couldn’t go more than half throttle so I didn’t know there was a huge problem but the more I ran it it developed a weird smell and the klotz smell was gone. Almost like a burning smell Next day fire it up fires first pull go in garage come out it sounded different. Then look on ground had something similar to what you have in your hand. When riding it around has a lot more power and klotz smell is back. Mental note for now on is to check exhaust! Nice job on the sled btw!
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Don't just check the exhaust, DOUBLE check it! This is the pipe that I had apart. I already removed a metric ton of mouse nest (including a dead mouse). I was certain that I had it all out. I was wrong!
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A long time ago we had a small fire burning yard waste. I set a plugged exhaust on the pile and "cooked" the mouse nest out of it. Since then whenever I parked a sled that was going to set for awhile I plugged the exhaust with those expanding plugs for the drain in the back of a boat.
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I had thoughts of dumping some fuel oil in the pipe and use a copper flex pipe to feed air from the compressor to burn it out. But I wanted to preserve my pretty paint, so that was going to be a last resort.
We plug the holes with steel wool, and always put mothballs under the cover. The mice like to chew up some wire insulation as well. That's a different nightmare.
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It started on the first pull. 8)
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It started on the first pull. 8)
Congratulations! I see you still have some snow. Happy sledding!
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Looks great
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Still waiting on snow. :'( Before the last of our snow melted, I was able to run it some. It runs great, but the clutching is a bit off. I started with E ramps that had been modified to Aaen spec that got it really close but not perfect. Now I have J ramps with a red spring in it, I haven't been able to run that combo yet. Engagement is around 5400 8).
I realized almost immediately that I will need more studs. I'm planning on adding some chisels. I also have a set of 38mm carbs on the bench that I'll be cleaning up to install as well.
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I'm back at it! At the end of last year I had the glue on the hood duct fail. Well, not really the glue...I painted the duct before gluing it in and the glue stuck to the paint but the paint did not stick to the duct. The result was a broken windshield and some minor scratches. The scratches buffed out, and I am in the process of modifying a replacement windshield.
I did start it up and warm it up good, it only took 3 pulls (fired on the second). I have some 3/4" picks and chisels on the way to replace the trail studs that are in it now. I am going to shave the lugs on the track down to 1/2". I have 120 picks coming, and 24 chisels. Is that going to be enough?
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Bummer on the glue fail. I can't remember if I used epoxy or fiberglass resin on ours.
As far as the number of studs. We have been running 44 per track. So 144 sounds like plenty.
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Track shaved and picks & chisels installed:
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That looks serious.
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This build has turned out really nice!
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Picks everywhere! The rule is one pick per horsepower, then what do they know.
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I haven't made it to the ice yet, but WOW does this thing hook up on the hard pack of a plowed dirt road! I had to tighten the track a little because it started to ratchet. Then I dropped the engagement rpm a little because I couldn't keep the front end from coming up too far. I'm going to tighten the limiter straps a notch as well. What a blast to ride!
I picked up a Polaris P85 and secondary this weekend. I won't have time to get them installed and tuned before the first race, but I'm looking forward to trying them out yet this year.
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I used the primary p85 off a 97 500rmk (evolved chassis). The secondary is an adjustable fancy helix arctic cat type? The belt I used is an arctic cat 0627-020 belt. The deflection is good and did not need to shim. P95 primary needs a 1/2 inch longer bolt. Secondary of course needs welded up and a slot cut for the square key.
J-1 43gr weights (need to verify weight) different profile weight, lots of weight on tip.
round Almond spring (140-320?)
Engagement 5500ish runs out fine.
10-MR weights 42.3gr (there is more details in the weight but not reweighing them)
10-44 weights 43.923gr
10-MW weights 44.160gr
The stock 500 ran a primary blue spring (120-300?) 70hpish
10-MR weights
Secondary had a R34 helix not sure on the secondary
This can give you a good starting point. Keep in mind my elevation is 10k-12k
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Thanks for the info! These clutches came off from a 93 Indy 500 efi. I haven't tried it yet, but I hear that the primary will bolt right on without modification. I knew the secondary was going to take some work to fit. Did you need to adjust the length of the Kawi jack shaft?
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Race is this weekend. I'm planning to go just for the grudge racing on Sunday. This will be the first time I've had it on the ice. I swapped it for the stock 36mm power jet carbs to some standard 38mm round slide Mikunis. Still have the Kawi clutches on it so not expecting to be TOO fast haha. Wish me luck!
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Race is this weekend. I'm planning to go just for the grudge racing on Sunday. This will be the first time I've had it on the ice. I swapped it for the stock 36mm power jet carbs to some standard 38mm round slide Mikunis. Still have the Kawi clutches on it so not expecting to be TOO fast haha. Wish me luck!
Be sure to take a camera crew. I am looking for some good video.
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Be sure to take a camera crew. I am looking for some good video.
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Yes!
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Picks everywhere! The rule is one pick per horsepower, then what do they know.
depends on what you're racing.
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Like to see your results.
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Won some, lost some...but had a blast!
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Congratulations!
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Thanks!
Here is some video: https://youtu.be/0-TZWJejcjM
It did fairly good the first 50 feet, but then would fall on it's face as it would over rev. As I would get further down the ice, the revs would drop, but they would drop too far. I'm really struggling with these Kawi clutches...time to get the Polaris clutches installed!
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Know your max rpms in drag racing you want to hit that within 50' of the starting line and have your secondary open up quickly. With the engine revving max rpms & your secondary is opening up fast (this pulls the engine down) which creates more speed if you don't have enough gearing then go up in size. If you have the clutches set up like this you never lift if you do the engine will not have enough power to turn a 1:1 ratio. The video you showed is good reference the wheelie takes up E.T..
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Excellent advise!!
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I'd like to add there is a couple ways to figure out everything you need to do. 1. The Wahl Brothers Racing catalog has very helpful set ups in calculations that with a little Math or a Calculator you can figure out what you need. 2nd a good friend of mine is a engineer that came up with a calculation that's within a tenth in mph & E.T.. 3rd there is always the Aaen clutching book along with Aaen's carburetor book all would get you going in the right direction. Everyone has different set ups and every sled will act differently to the same set up.
If you believe your engine puts out 100hp @ 9250 rpms most engine builders will tell you it's about 1/2 to the track the only way you get more to the track is less rotating mass weight & must roll without restrictions (drag).
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Thanks for the info. I called and ordered the clutch tuning handbook today.
I put in a different weight spring combo last night, I'm going to test it this evening. If all goes well I am going to a 600ft radar run tomorrow morning.
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Take a black magic marker mark the inside sheave of the primary also do this to the secondary make one pass the belt will wear off the marker this will be helpful on what changes you have to do repeat the markings after every pass to see if you improved or not
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Another great tip, thanks! I will definitely try that when the time comes. However I have come to the conclusion that the motor just isn't making good power in the higher rpm revs. I believe what is happening is that the Kawasaki kit pipes that I'm running are tuned to run around 8200, and my cylinders are ported to run much higher (I believe 9250). I am working on a set of pipes that are tuned to make power in the 9300 rpm range. I'm hoping to finish them up this weekend and get them installed next week. While I wait to finish the pipes, I will work on reading the Aaen tuning book, I'm hoping it gets here before the weekend.
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Get a note book and write down everything so the target is 9250. Example what you have now gearing, drivers, track width, length, skid along with wheel sizes and how many studs or picks, carburetor settings, clutches springs, weights, exhaust pipe, tachometer, temperature on engine, temperature of outside & barometer keeping notes you can look back on what you did. Any little change I use to write it down. Rotating mass is power loss.
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Just read through this thread from the beginning. What a great build and beautiful work on the sled.
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Let’s see if these make any power...
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Nice pipes I was going to tell you in my note book I even wrote down everything I did to the engine including what water pump or no water pump. Out here (MN) in stock class (drag race) you don't have to run a water pump quick connections is all you need but then you get back to the pits & plug into a cool down cart.
Can't wait to hear what you did for times down a track
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Not sure when I’ll be able to get to another race to get some times, with the way the extended forecast looks it likely won’t be until next season 😞
I’ve been reading the clutch tuning guide and making some clutching adjustments. I’m having an odd problem, I pulled some weight from the primary ramps to get the r’s up where I believe it’ll make power (around 9300). It'll run up to around 8600, then drop to 8000 and climb back to 8600 the drop 8000. It'll cycle just like that over and over. It almost sounds like it misses. Any ideas?
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What secondary are you using ?. The drop down in rpms would cause 3 things not correct ramp, spring & setting spring location. Aaen states how much tension using a fish scale this would be how much weight is being pulled back. The primary needs to hold the rpms & the secondary is pulling. Example Polaris P85 primary K-1 weight 40g with a 165-310 engagement with .020 belt clearance should put you at 6500-7000 rpms, p85 secondary 36 ramp light blue spring 2nd hole would be pretty good pull a red spring in the secondary might be to loose this will pull down the rpms of its in the 1st hole you can never lift
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Also check your timing & carburetors to make sure you are getting enough fuel for the top end. What we learned is come in high within 50' you need to be in the power range so if your engine says 8800 rpms this means your primary weights are too heavy yet you are looking for 9300 clutching isn't a easy task it takes time to get it right
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I'm fairly confident that it's not a clutching issue. I can hear a subtle hesitation, or pop when it climbs in RPM just before it drops 500 rpm, almost like a misfire. So far I have tried a different CDI box and new spark plugs with the same result. I set the timing per the manual, then adjusted it per the Kawasaki Performance kit instructions (slightly advanced).
I put a different coil in it last night but didn't have time to try it (I'll do that tonight). If that doesn't help I am going to pull the carbs and see if maybe I missed something when I cleaned them. I'm running 38mm mikunis with the stock airbox installed. I have 320 main jets in it (we are at 600ft elevation). Does that sound like I'm in the right neighborhood?
Thanks for your help. :)
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Is the exciter coil & pulsar coil good ? The popping can come from to far advanced try the stock location. The other thing to look for is your kill switch sometimes the toggle doesn't have a good positive connection some of the aftermarket tethers needs a little screw in the cap. What did your plugs look like (color) that will determine if need to go up or down on your jetting. 38mm carburetors are good
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As far as I know the stator is good. I am seeing no other signs that it could be bad. The kill switch is NOS and the tether is a new OEM Polaris unit. Being that it's consistently RPM based, I'm leaning toward either a fueling issue, or maybe the timing is too far advanced for this setup.
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I was remembering wrong about the timing. The kit instructions had me set it a little retarded (which seems backwards to me). I put a timing light on it and it was acting a little funny, I couldn’t see the timing marks consistently, only once in a while. So I pulled the stator and flywheel and replaced them and reset the timing to stock. It still acts funny when I have the timing light on it, I’m not sure what to make of that. When I do see the timing mark it’s right on though. It’s been several years since I’ve set the timing on one of these, maybe that’s normal? I’m hoping to take it out for a ride tomorrow night to test the new flywheel/stator, but I’m not hopeful.
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Just a question here do you have a ground from the engine to the chassis
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It has the stock wire harness and ground points, so I assume it's grounded. I will measure it to verify.
No change with the different flywheel and stator. That pretty much rules out the ignition system. I'm stumped. :'(
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Considering that the engine will run on its own when not connected to the sled wiring harness, a ground issue can be easily ruled out. I am no expert on racing, but I am wondering if the carbs might be at the upper limit of their ability to supply fuel. What size fuel needle is installed in the carbs? Also, the Interceptor opted for two fuel pumps. Is it possible that the pump is at or near its limit when the engine is running at the higher RPMs?
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That is possible. Although at 100% throttle the needle is completely out of the picture and the carbs should be regulated only by the main jets.
Another piece of information that I neglected to share is that when I ran it at 30 degrees it ran worse. It would only run a consistent 8100 instead. If it were a lean condition causing the issue I would expect it to run better in the warmer temps.
Good idea to unplug the wire harness. Unfortunately it’s 50 degrees and raining here now, so I’m not sure when I’ll be able to run it again.
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The needle that I was questioning is the fuel needle/seat that meters fuel into the bowl. It could be possible that the difference in RPM could be coming from whether the fuel needle is open or not. Just conjecture on my part.
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Right from the Wahlracing book
VM38 carburetor main jet 360 needle jet 166 Q-O, jet needle 6DH3, Pilot jet 40, needle & seat 1.5, slide 2.5 this is what they come stock. How close is your set up ?. What fuel pump are you using ?.
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VM38s 320 mains, 35 pilots, 6dh7 needle (middle clip), Q0 needle jets. Stock Invader fuel pump. Carbs were thoroughly cleaned and new jets installed.
These specs came from a friend who is running a modified 550.
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A modified 550 is different than a mod 440. Air velocity on how fast you can push through your ports with the proper carb set up. On air velocity in your timed ports the higher you go with rpms the window gets smaller there for you need more fuel to compensate.
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Ok, I picked up some 360 mains and put them in last night. Luckily we got a few inches of snow last night and the temps dropped to the mid 20’s. I took it for a ride today with the larger jets and it’ll jump up to 8200 then drop quickly, if I hold it open it will drop to 6500 or lower.
I did notice when I got back that the plugs are different colors. One is carmel color and the other is dark grey. I’m not sure what that means?
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Needle and seat are 1.5, slide is brass 3.0
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Caramel like light brown is ok but dark grey is not good. 3.0 slides is pretty big which side is the Carmel plug on ?. Dark grey is indicating it's lean
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Caramel like light brown is ok but dark grey is not good. 3.0 slides is pretty big which side is the Carmel plug on ?. Dark grey is indicating it's lean
The 3.0's seem to work well. I don't recall which side was lean. Next on my list was to disconnect the wire harness from the engine and try it again. I was also going to take my plug wrench with me and check the plugs after a WOT run. Where I live I have to run it real easy for the first 1/4 mile or so before I can rip on it... Unfortunately it's been 40's and raining here, looks like it will be next season before I can continue. :(
Odd that just one side is lean. What are the possible causes?
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Tom,
It really sounds like you are running out of fuel in the carburetors. 330 mains is what I can calculate from my notes should be very close to correct.
Do a plug chop before the motor motor flows the piston out. 1 motor to operating temp, 2 New plugs, 3 wide open throttle on a jack stand THREE SECONDS, 4 pull plugs and inspect.
lots of solutions from here.
Looking at the grounding straps the "burn mark" no longer looking shiney new and the line on the strap that looks brand new. Where is that line with respect down the grounding strap? The perfect a/f ratio presents the burn line in the middle of the bend of that grounding strap.
Cut the end of the threaded portion of the spark plug off with an angle grinder. The insulating ceramic portion is what to look at and the "smoke" line marks lean or rich. You want that in the middle of the white ceramic.
Note the temperature and I assume you are near sea level. Every 1000ft makes a notable change as well as every 20 degrees of temp. All the other main jet choices can be calculated from your plug chop presenting correctly.
I suspect your fuel pump is not keeping up with the demand. Wideband stand alone system reins supreme. Plug chop just as effective.
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I pulled the heads and noticed that the piston wash is showing that both sides are running slightly rich. Which is odd being that the one plug was a little grey.
I have been working on switching over to Polaris clutches. I'm just waiting for the belt and new clutch bolt to come and I will be ready for testing.
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I just noticed something On your primary you have a Electric start gear ring on it is the alignment correct between the 2 clutches also did you put in a snubber to hold the engine from twisting
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No ring gear on the clutch...there are some balancing holes drilled in the edge of the shiv that are visible in the picture.
No snubber installed yet.
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My bad I had to zoom in the picture better
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Tom,
On the p-85 clutching system I used the Polaris Secondary. Pulled the stock K shaft and had it cut and welded to accept the slide on drift keyway secondary from the Polaris. If I was going for really fancy I would have used a Team secondary if all my Christmas gifts were used. The solutions are then dialed via Polaris 440 race program (2004) to make the clutches do all you can dream up.
Glad i looked at this thread. Your are chasing my pipe dream!
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Polaris Clutches installed just in time for just one test ride. The conditions weren’t ideal but good enough to put a smile on my face ;D. It performs MUCH better than any combination of Kawasaki clutching that I tried. Engagement was around 6000, and it held steady at 8800-8900 until I ran out of runway.
It was relatively easy to install the Polaris secondary: Shorten the jack shaft by 1/2”(cut the clutch side), then cut a 1/4” keyway 4.25” from the cut end and you’re ready to install. Source some various thickness 1” shims to install between the bearing and the secondary on the jack shaft. Use these shims to determine the correct offset. The stock Kawasaki secondary bolt is too long, so I used and extra gear bolt and washer from the other end of the jack shaft. Use the stock aluminum secondary shims under the bolt to shim the secondary. It needs to “float” by .040”. No welding was required.
For next season I will be installing ported 4/6 cylinders and custom shaped high compression heads (Thanks Interceptor398 for the awesome work on the heads!). I have already pulled the trail ported Invader cylinders (they will be going on my trail rider 81 Invader along with the twin Kit pipes), the porting proved to be less than optimal for the high rpm tune of the new pipes.
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Have you played with the Comet clutches?
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Have you played with the Comet clutches?
I built up a comet but decided not to install it, instead I went right to the Polaris setup. From my research, there really isn't any improvement over the Kawasaki clutch in switching to the comet. Unless you cannot find the different springs and weights for the Kaw clutch. There are however many benefits in switching to the newer design Polaris clutches. The biggest being the larger diameter gives it overdrive, this allows for lower gearing which equals better performance. I am going to run 340 gears in my 81 Invader and expect to run the same top speed. Plus the newer design is more efficient, which means more power to the track.
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Still have that set up comet? Would you be willing to sell it?
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Gix,
Just a revisit of this thread. For that P85 secondary you just cut 0.5in and cut the keyway ignoring the splines? Wish I could have seen that move. Makes for a snap on the next p85 system.
Thanks for the share!
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Gix,
Just a revisit of this thread. For that P85 secondary you just cut 0.5in and cut the keyway ignoring the splines? Wish I could have seen that move. Makes for a snap on the next p85 system.
Thanks for the share!
Yes, after shortening the shaft there wasn't much left of the splines anyway, no reason they can't be ignored. Other than going through the work of removing the jackshaft, it was a very easy modification. I had my machinist do the work, he only charged me around $40 if I remember correctly.
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I've finally gotten back to working on "the green sled"... I decided to build an entirely new motor for it. I removed the ribs in the upper half of the crankcase that split the air before going into the cylinders, installed some ported 4/6 cylinders, custom cut high compression heads (Thanks Interceptor398!), and Polaris ignition. I dumped in some 110 race fuel and it fired right up. The first ride showed some promise, but I have some clutch tuning to do. It still seems to not want to make power over 8500 rpm which I'm surprised by...I may end up with some 100% custom built pipes by the time I'm done with this thing.
I've got a race coming up in less than 2 weeks. Hoping to get it on the ice again by then.
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8500rpms are you running out of space length wise. Have you taken a black magic marker and mark the sleeves primary & secondary (inside) this should tell you how far the belt goes.
Example say you mark the clutches you hit the 8500 rpms you come to a stop the worn mark only goes 1/2 way on your clutches this means you’re not geared right (too high)
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8500rpms are you running out of space length wise. Have you taken a black magic marker and mark the sleeves primary & secondary (inside) this should tell you how far the belt goes.
Example say you mark the clutches you hit the 8500 rpms you come to a stop the worn mark only goes 1/2 way on your clutches this means you’re not geared right (too high)
Yeah, I took some measurements of the pipes I'm running and sent them to an engine builder friend. He did some calculations and said they should make good power 8300 to 8500 RPM, so I guess that's where I'll run it for now.
I'm familiar with the magic marker trick, I have the Aaen clutching book and have been studying it as I go. It's been warm here recently so the iced over dirt road I normally test on is turning brown in spots so my testing space is very limited.
I do have it engaging just below 6000, pulling hard to 8500, then dropping to around 8200 or so and staying. It was very warm when I tested around 34F, it's supposed to be colder on race day so I'm thinking it'll work well.
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Update: Race day went ok... With the lack of testing time, I just went on Sunday for the "Grudge Racing". I ran a few times down the 660ft track. It ran ok, but wasn't pulling full RPM after the first 100ft or so. I also had an issue with the chain slipping which cut my day short.
Since then, I was able to fix the slipping chain with a stronger spring and new chain. I also fixed the dropping RPM with a different secondary spring. I've got it dialed in really close but I am not happy with the results. I have my modified 81 Invader 440 performing the same or better on pump gas. So...it's back to the drawing board. I have sent some 4/6 cylinders and Liquifire heads to my engine builder in Canada. The ports will be welded and reshaped, the heads will be shaved and reshaped as well. I am also replacing the pipes. I have started to modify some 4/6 LTD pipes to specs given to me by the engine builder. Tuning it to run 9200 and with open stingers, it'll be fast and loud!
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Spring in the chain case ?. Wahl brothers racing sells a kit to have adjustable bearing with a bolt to keep the chain tight you have to drill a hole in the chain case and this would eliminate the spring.
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Spring in the chain case ?. Wahl brothers racing sells a kit to have adjustable bearing with a bolt to keep the chain tight you have to drill a hole in the chain case and this would eliminate the spring.
The new chain and tougher spring seems to be doing the trick so far, but I'll definitely keep that option in mind. Thanks!
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It's been a looooong time since I've given an update on the Intimidator... I finally made a significant breakthrough with it the end of last season, I found that the aftermarket tach was reading a little more than 1000 RPM too low, so when I'd tune the clutches for it to run 9200 RPM on the tach, it'd actually be running 10200 RPM. If you've ever looked at the power curve for these, or ever rev'd one yourself, you know that the power drops off dramatically. This made tuning a nightmare. Anyway, I have the tach fixed, and am running stock 4/6 pipes with ported 4/6 cylinders, and shaved and reshaped Liquifire heads on race fuel. It pulls extremely hard at 8700 RPM. I've got some fine tuning to do, and want to give my other pipes a try, but I'm really looking forward to this season.
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What do you think caused the misread on the RPMs? 10% low sounds excessive.
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What do you think caused the misread on the RPMs? 10% low sounds excessive.
I was using an aftermarket automotive tach, I believe that the way the Kaw ignition/lighting systems are designed caused the tach to read incorrectly and ultimately fail. I switched back to a stock tach for the end of last season and have since bought a new tach along with a “tach adapter” that should allow proper operation.