Author Topic: I might want to put a Polaris skid in my Invader, but I need some info first  (Read 7702 times)

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freak_in_cage

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Hello Guru's,

I recently acquired a 1980 Invader. It's basically been sitting for the last 18 years, with the exception of the short ride I took on it about 8 years ago. I am going through this thing from front to back and the goal is to have a reliable and reasonably comfortable machine. I've got the motor covered as to what's needed to make it good, but I need to know about suspension.

I know I'm going to have to spend money on the rear. Since I will have to pull the skid, I'm toying with the idea of putting in a bit more modern suspension that is a bit easier to get parts for. I have seen it mentioned many times on the web "I put a Polaris skid in mine and it wasn't hard" and "all you do is drill some holes and bolt it in", but there is no real info I can find on this mod.

For the people that have done this, my questions are:

1. What years and models of sleds are good donors?
2. What is really all involved?

Thanks in advance.
1980 Kawasaki Invader 440

Interceptor398

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I have only seen one sled in person with a different suspension in it.  The person later went back to the stock one.  What parts do you need for the stock one??

Checkmarks

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Good years? 1990 to 2000 take your pick. (121)

What is really involved?  K's tunnel is 17in in the front, P is 15in.  Use the aluminum shaft out of the K and put one inch spacers on each side.

Use the front original bolt holes, then measure and drill the holes for the rear of the sled.  Might be that you have to remove the steel plates in the rear of the K.  Beyond that it is a bolt in.

10 inch suspensions lift the back too much and you submarine around in the snow.  7 inch suspensions work fine.  The stock K works just as good as any.  There is no such thing as luxury riding old leaf spring.     

gixxer6

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I've found that the Vari-Ride used in the LTD's and 81' Invaders ride just as nice as the 90's Polaris sleds.  Well...at least in the rear, like Checkmarks says, the front leaf springs are certainly a hindrance.  Although, I'm not sure swapping to a Vari-Ride would be any easier of a task than swapping to a Polaris skid.  IMO either would be a worthwhile project.  There was a noticeable improvement in ride quality when switching from my old 79' Invader to the 81', especially when using a gas shock on the 81. 

freak_in_cage

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398
It needs a new shock and spring, some bearings but the major thing is a couple of the steel brackets are cracked. So I either have to fabricate new ones, find nos replacements or find a donor. I'm currently just weighing my options.

Checkmarks

Thanks for the info, that's exactly what I was looking for. Not to sound daft, but how do I know if it's a 7" or 10"? Is it model specific or just a matter of which shocks/springs it has?

Checkmarks and Gixxer

I know this thing will never ride like a Cadillac. I am just trying to get something a little softer in the rear. And hopefully easier on my back.  I realize that they are 2 different animals, but I have an old Pantera that has relatively new suspension and it still rides like a brick...I imagine that the Kawi would be somewhat similar.
1980 Kawasaki Invader 440

Lloyd (ljm)

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There is a fair bit different in between a 7 and 10.

 10 came out about 95 in some models.  Any Indy suspension from 93 and earlier will be a 7 for sure
77 SST
78 Intruder
79 340 Invader
80 440 Invader
80 Drifter (bought new)
80 LTD 4/6    X2

Several Deeres

freak_in_cage

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I pulled the skid tonight to do a real inspection and its rougher than I thought. Aside from the front pivot being seized, both front spring mounts are separating, both swing arm brackets are bent and the holes are severely eleongated, it's just basically done.



I measured it up and the front mounting shaft is 18" wide, the rear is 17.5" wide and the mounting holes on the sled are 30" apart. This is contradicting the measurements I've been told previously. Anyway, I went on my local buy and sell and found a skid out of a 90's Indy wedge (no pic), one out of a 93 trail (next pic) and then stumbled upon a 95 MX Skidoo (last pic) the skidoo measures 16.5" wide and 28" center to center of mounts. What do you guys feel would be the best candidate?

1980 Kawasaki Invader 440

Gilson435

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I would stay away from the Skidoo suspension... it is much heavier and actually has two rear mounting locations for the rear shocks. The Polaris suspension is lighter, and easier to install as far as figuring out the geometry. Ski-Doo has never been known for having a real great rear suspension while the Polaris is tried and true a good suspension. Are the rail center to center distances the same on Kawi and Polaris? I thought I also heard one time some of the idler wheels may need to be spaced differently as to not interfere with the drive nubs on the track. Just something to keep in mind I guess...

Yeah that Kawi suspension is pretty spent ;)
69 Panther 372 JLO
73 Gilson 435
80 Kawasaki Intruder 440
81 Pantera,93 Jag,(2)94 Cougars, (2)Prowlers, (2)Z440's
2002 Polaris XCSP 800

freak_in_cage

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I really don't know if the rails are the same distance apart. I guess I will find out. I know that Checkmarks put a Polaris skid in his Kawi, and if there was an issue, I'm sure it would have been mentioned...if not exact it's gotta be pretty close. I also recall reading something about wheel spacers, I guess I will see about that too.

I ended up picking up the suspension in the first pic (from a '93 Trail) for $100. It's 16" wide, and my tunnel is 18", so like Checkmarks said I will have to add 1" spacers. It's missing one idler, which will be pretty easy to get. I plan on doing some test fitting tonight. If it's true (I don't think that the advice I received is false in any way) that I am able to use the front skid mounting points on the Kawi and just drill new rear holes, this will be one of the easiest suspensions mods I've ever done on a motorized toy.

Thanks for all the input from everyone.

On a side note, my engine gasket set should be sitting at home when I get there...Hopefully I have this sled back in the snow again soon.
1980 Kawasaki Invader 440

Teherr

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nice thread.  prompted me to just buy a 95 polaris xlt skid on ebay for $150 w/shipping.  I presently have 2 LTD's and the biggest issue with the vari-ride is that every one I have has their aluminum shafts stuck and they nearly impossible to get out.  I bought a 1" lug track for one of them, so I will probably use the polaris skid with 1" track.  I plan to oval race these sleds and it appears you can shorten the suspension straps to lower it for better cornering. 
440 Invaders
440 LTD Monohead
Liquifire
80' 4/6 
Intruder Ice Oval Racer
74 El Tigre T7 Free Air
80 Polaris 440 TX
250 & 340 Enticers

gixxer6

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Ugh...stuck suspension shafts....   I have spent many hours with a sledgehammer on those darn things! 

I put a 1" camoplast hacksaw track on my 81 Invader, by far the best modification I have done on a Kaw.  At least it was for the type of riding I like to do. 

sprocket

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It's not just a spacer you'll need to make longer shafts as well. I ran a 1982 Polaris Cutluss  suspension it was softer than the ones you mentioned.  Put the suspension in and see if anything hits or not if it does just move the wheels, you will have to make longer shafts & spacers to fit your chassis. Most swap meets are selling these type of  suspensions for about $25.  You still have to go through the bearings and slides to put in new but at least it gives you a starting point.
 If you're looking for a 10 inch suspension look for an M10.  Also make sure you get the correct length of suspension to fit your track
 That ski doo suspension is like riding a lumber wagon those came in Mach's

freak_in_cage

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I'm using the skid from a 93 trail, with the aluminum cross shafts from the Kawi. The spacers will be cut from the Kawi skid. Lloyd (ljm) has been a huge help with measurements from his sled. Once I get this put in, I'll provide the measurements that worked for me.

Getting the aluminum shaft out of the Kawi skid took about an hour of pounding this way and then the other and repeating. Super fun. Haha
« Last Edit: February 08, 2016, 12:23:54 PM by freak_in_cage »
1980 Kawasaki Invader 440

freak_in_cage

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I got the Polaris skid put in tonight and I think I might have to move it forward an inch or so. The center to center of the shafts on my Polaris skid was 24 11/16". The front mount placed using an unused rivet hole in the Kawi spring tension mount thing and the rear is 1 13/16" forward of the original.


The sled seems to sit properly...the track is sitting flat and it goes up to the drive wheels at a decent angle (at least I think it does) to the drive wheels. The idler wheels all seem to sit properly in the middle of the track cogs.



The reason I think I have to move the skid forward is because I suspended the rear, hung 10 pounds off the track and adjusted until the track no longer touched the rear of the skid frame at the rear wheels. Right now I have about 1/8" from the top corner of aluminum frame to the metal clip on the track and with the 10 pounds hanging on the track I only have about 1/2" from slider to the track. Having said that, I can move the the track relatively easily by turning the secondary clutch. I hope that all makes sense.

I still need to make steel tunnel straps. I have 2" flat stock the same thickness as the originals and I have to get 2 idlers for the skid. One is worn out and one is missing.
1980 Kawasaki Invader 440

Lloyd (ljm)

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 Looks good!
77 SST
78 Intruder
79 340 Invader
80 440 Invader
80 Drifter (bought new)
80 LTD 4/6    X2

Several Deeres