LTD motor fit in Invader belly...?

[Macs80hp440]

Can't find the answer anywhere on this site.  Maybe it because the answer is no.  I want to know if a LTD motor can be fitted into a '78-'80 Invader.

QUESTION 1:  Can the '81-'82 LTD motor fit in the '78-'80 invader belly or motor mount? 

QUESTION 2:  And can it fit with '78-'80 invader hood? Or, can it use the '78-'80 radiator so the original hood still fits.

QUESTION 3:  can the dual pipes fit in the belly pan of '78-'80.

[Checkmarks]

Answer 1:  No the 81-82 Ltd motor will not drop in.  You must cut and re-weld the motor mounts about one inch wider.  You must have the left side motor mount, original regular invader motor mount does not work.

Answer 2:  Yes the lighter hoods fit or if you want the extra weight the 80 hood fits.  You need to modify yourself a bracket for the invader radiator to work.

Answer 3:  the pipes fit.

  Not a very practical choice to make these modifications for just a few extra Hp.  It is a lot of work (Lot of work = time = money) to make moves like this.  In the end your sled will be worth bupkis.  Nobody wants your chopped up modified 30 plus year, you should get the point.  It is far better to get an understanding for jetting squeaking out the potential of 70Hp. 

[Tory944]

  Well stated.........

[Macs80hp440]

  It is far better to get an understanding for jetting squeaking out the potential of 70Hp. 

Asked and answered.  Who am I to argue.

[Macs80hp440]

Ok- actually I have two counter points.

In the end your sled will be worth bupkis. 

Keep in mind, the Invaders were over produced anyway.  They aren't worth a lot to begin with.  A better argument would be wasting an LTD motor in an Invader chassis.

  Not a very practical choice to make these modifications for just a few extra Hp. 

Don't forget, the LTD motors had about 20-25% more torque.  I'm not sure a jet tweek will gain that much, maybe porting and such, but then there again- how much work for the small gain.

At any rate- I know I appreciate one very profound fact.  When I ask a question on this site, it gets answered directly and with detail.  God Bless.

[Checkmarks]

In the end your sled is the one that gets ridden by only you.  I personally am all for your work, nothing I love more than seeing modifications.  Take an old sled little, light and small and then put a bigger motor.  This concept is far better than the options out there with these 11ft sleds so big and heavy it takes two to get it unstuck.  Or $20,000 to lighten them up.  Old school is my school.

There is guilt in my words.  550 stuffed into a regular invader just to beat my friends out oval racing.  Well, those Srx's are faster and even a 71 650 chapperel.  It took putting in a 521 rotax type 537 in a polaris suspension dolled up to look like a Kawasaki to be them in a circle.  Tried ultra hard to get the 521 squeezed into the Kawasaki sled; just could not make it work.

Keep in mind I consider myself as an end user.  Beyond me whatever it is goes to the trash provide there are no parts worth salvage.  No resale value in my head only metal recyclable value.

Yes put in the Ltd motor and IFS the Invader.  My sleds whip booty and ride more like the modern.  136 1.5 track, the list is endless.  Keep in mind only the reality of progression is the direction of modern sleds, unless you are wealthy and do not mind burning your money. 

[JosephNiemi]

if you do want to sell it,  well done modification might bring good money,  if the buyer was looking for that.  if you are doing if for yourself,  that is just cool.  but if selling it is something you would want to do,  i would look into a modern engine swap,  the "retro" classes are starting to get big around here,  classes for vintage sleds with new engines.  my old man has a '76 sno-twister with a '79 ski-doo sno-pro 440 in it.  maybe i need to keep my eyes open for another $50 invader...resist..the sickness...aaahhhh

[Macs80hp440]

For me, as a beginner collector- one aspect I am trying to target for myself is the strongest 440cc stock trail sled from the late 70s early 80s as this was just prior to the mid80s Polaris fanfare with indy and triple motors.  The strongest stock 440cc in a 70s chassis (early 80s) are the Blizzard and LTD.  Next group gets bigger with Invader, Kohler power (several brands), Xenoah power, and Brut in the Scorpion years.  Keep in mind the SRX is an obvious top dog in 440cc power, but I do not consider that a trail sled.  (by the way- another good collection idea are the strongest 340cc, but that list of brands is basically the same)

Anyway- the Kaw option is among the cheapest to get started in that list.  But, the more expensive Kaw option (in 440) is the LTD.  So- yes, this idea is my way to get LTD power in a Kaw chassis without paying for the whole LTD.  I guess you could call me a wanna-be in that regard, yes?

Incidentally- I often wonder how much more power the Invader or LTD could be if they had incorporated a reed valve.  Some of the other high power 440's have this feature.

Lastly-  My current project is my first restoration effort.  It is three Invaders into two.  I've been keeping my eye on a good LTD motor as a "bonus" feature in this project.  I dream of one day restoring three Rupps or Bruts into two...but that is a whole different price range and difficulty level in parts finding...right?

...or maybe any combination of high power 440 motor and chassis...yea- that's another fun idea.

[jimvw57]

well, if I had an LTD motor sitting there , and an Invader without a motor, why not?? It's not like you will be struck by lightning or anything, it's just a lot of work.

 saw a 4 cylinder motor from a Crosley  put in a 1974 Arctic Cat Panther... it just hummed going down the trail. Te install was one of the best I have ever seen and a truly amazing machine. No doubt he spent a lot of time and money on iut but to him it was worth every bit!

[Lloyd (ljm)]

 I know Interceptor engines have been put into JD Liquifire's. If that can be done there is no reason putting an LTD engine in an Invader can't be done.

 I think it would make a cool sled.

[gixxer6]

If I'm remembering correctly, Trucker put an Interceptor engine into an Invader...The 81-82 LTD's have the exact same engine mounting. 

[Duhnis]

Go ahead and do the engine swap It will  spank a LTD in a drag race, due to the lighter weight.
 I did this swap  years ago after I wadded up the LTD.  The tech guys never bothered it and it ran very well against the 500cc  sleds.
  As for the 521 comment, I will get some  pics  of the invader with the Rotax 583 in it, My current sleeper project. The single pipe is being replaced with twins. I will try  to post them tomorrow night.

Duhnis

[Shawn]

I own both an '82 LTD and regular 440 Invader. In my experience the "rated" horsepower difference between the six port twin head 440 and the eight port monohead 440 is misleading. Real world seat of the pants feel while riding has taught me the monohead 440 packs noticeably more mid range and top end punch. If you can weld or know someone who would be willing to help you get the engine mounts welded in for proper clutch alignment the hard work will be done. I feel it would be well worth your time if you have a good running monohead to install. Bolt in the true LTD VariRide skid and use LTD ski springs to make it really nice to ride.   

[Checkmarks]

Duhnis,

WHAT you got the rotax to fit in the vader or is that an evadetax or maybe Rovader!  This is a must see; please post some pictures.  I tried several attempts to make something work and could not see the solution. 

583 sleeper, got to even surprise 700's.  I need your help.  Two months until the ovals start running.  Please hurry with the pictures.

All summer I waited to find some twinkle of motivation to get some Kawasaki work done.  This gives me some new twist to work.